If you were to buy into atheist propaganda on the Internet you would have no choice but to conclude that Christians are some of the most ignorant, irrational, dishonest, deluded idiots on the planet. In short if you are a Christian, then you are stupid. You can substitute whatever other derogatory term you would like in the place of stupid. The point is that something is seriously wrong with the idiots who believe these nonsensical fairy tales, etc. etc. You have heard it all before. You get the point.
Of course I do not really need the atheists to tell me that there are plenty of Christians who are ignorant, irrational, dishonest, and deluded. I have spent my entire life around Christians. I am a Christian. It is safe to say that I know Christians better than the vast majority of atheists do. If I were pressed on it I would have to admit that I have met some rather stupid Christians.
But atheists want to say much more than that there just happen to be stupid Christians. They want to say that there is something inherent to Christianity itself, or to Christians themselves, which renders every encounter with a Christian a futile one. They really mean to say what was mentioned above; if you are a Christian then you are stupid.
This is where the atheist runs into a significant problem. It is not the case that every Christian is stupid. It is probably not the case that even most Christians are stupid. In fact history is littered with examples of extremely intelligent people who believed in God, the Bible, the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and the like. We have Christians to thank for many of our modern scientific and technological moorings. We have Christians to thank for many of our modern cultural and moral advancements. Even today there are churchgoing believers who are practicing doctors, lawyers, engineers, and scientists. They are professors, teachers, clergy, and authors. These are the Christians in your neighborhood, in your neighborhood, in your neigh-bor-hood oh! These are the Christians in your neighborhood; the Christians that you meet each day.
So the atheist claim to inherent Christian stupidity is stupid. It does not match the empirical data. Atheists often make rather sweeping claims about the absurdity of theistic conceptions, the absurdity of believing them, the absurdity of miracles or believing in them and the like. Many of these claims also entail that Christians are stupid. Given what I have stated above, these claims are untenable. That is a problem for your average online atheist predator.
Atheists almost have to believe that Christians are stupid. But Christians are not stupid.
Christians are not stuck with this sort of problem. Atheists are not stupid. We can fully acknowledge the contributions of atheists and even thank God for them. Christians have an explanation for the stupidity of Christians and atheists alike. It is foolishness, folly, sin. Christians also have an explanation for the contributions of atheists. It is formal agreement, borrowed capital, common grace.
Atheists are not stupid because atheists are not. That is, while anyone (Christian or atheist) is subject to practical atheism – living as though God is not there – no one can live as an atheist in principle. Anti-theism presupposes theism.
24 responses to “Why Christians Are Stupid and Atheists Are Not”
1) You say that atheists say Christians are stupid – What atheists say/said that Christians are stupid?
2) Are you also saying that atheists don’t exist?
You are mistaken; having read neither reddit, nor anything else on this site.
“Creatards, please stop breeding. You do the planet a huge disservice. Why ? Because, you’re dumbing down the gene pool. You don’t have the ability for abstract, nor rational thought. We thank you in advance. “
Although I am a Christian, as the Internet’s Christian Songwriter’s Network lyricist, gruvEdude, I wrote how I agree that Christians aren’t too wise.
GOD JUDGES THE HEART
God judges the heart.
Our words shalt not matter.
As long as it’s praise,
The Lord they shalt flatter.
Too foolish to practice,
At work, school, and home.
God judges the heart.
Let’s praise Thee alone.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Amen, halleju!
Like humans, we know,
God’s ways sure get olde.
To witness Him more
Would be rather cold.
So when we are with
Our friends that have faith,
Practice bad habits.
Just trust and obey.
Other than the assertions in the last two sentences, I totally agree.
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Atheists may not be dumb but they are fools.
I found something both ironic and humorous about this article…
during its entirety you stress how atheists believe Christians are stupid…. as a whole… every last one.
and yet, I don’t recall even one situation where you refer to the atheists in a way other than “as a whole”… not a single “most”, “some”, “a lot”, “many”….. nope… you refer to atheists…. as a whole… every last one.
but congratulations on destroying all credibility the argument may have had before you ever posted it. you could almost call it… (mind the pun) a stupid move.
I’m not sure what post you read Rob, but I never once use the phrase, “as a whole” in the post above, nor do I assume it. You are seeing what you want to see.
I am not Christian, Atheist or Agnostic, I am Anti-theist. You most certainly are “stupid”, as are all Christians. Belief in something with no real evidence to support anything of the sort based solely on nonsense you have learned from others is ridiculous. I do not need to cite intelligent people who have contributed anything to modern society, the point is this: quite simply, if you believe in some imaginary “savior,” you are, in fact, stupid. Do you believe that a turkey sandwich in your fridge does yoga and smokes cigarettes when you close the door? Certainly not, yet it is more believable than 90% of the Bible, and you can actually prove a turkey sandwich exists. Christians are stupid because there is a group-think mentality that forces rationality out of the equation. I find it reprehensible that you mention that think you “know Christians better than the vast majority of atheists do,” what makes you think so? Atheists know Christians, they were raised by them, spent Sundays with them before realizing the folly, went to school, played, and worked with them. Atheists know Christians better than you could possibly imagine. You are a closed minded hack who believes in something that is not only improbable, but logically impossible. Empirical data remarks are noted as well, I always love that, you do not even attempt to back up these “facts.” Here is a little data for you, religion is the cause, or a part of the cause, of nearly every war that has ever occurred on this planet (I sincerely hope you are not too stupid to acknowledge that).
“I am not Christian, Atheist or Agnostic, I am Anti-theist.”
Do you get like a special suit to wear with leather pants and a big “A” on the front of your top?
“You most certainly are ‘stupid’, as are all Christians.”
I can already tell that this will be an enlightening read.
“Belief in something with no real evidence to support anything of the sort based solely on nonsense you have learned from others is ridiculous.”
This gets so old. Once you get out of high school, and assuming you can get into college, you may be able to take a philosophy class that might teach you that people actually believe things without evidence. We all do. All the time. Yourself included. But more than that, you may learn to think more critically and ask yourself tougher questions like, ‘What exactly is the nature of evidence?’ and ‘How do I really know that there is not any?’. Right now you just sound like a presumptuous kid who has been spending too much time on reddit atheism. You believe that any claim without evidence to support it is ridiculous, but what evidence do you have for *that* belief? None. So epistemologists decided a long time ago that your rather weak attempt at an evidentialist objection belongs in the wastebasket.
“I do not need to cite intelligent people who have contributed anything to modern society,”
Right, so you demand evidence from Christians, whatever that means and for whatever reason, but you are not inclined to produce any to support your own position. How convenient!
“…the point is this: quite simply, if you believe in some imaginary ‘savior,’”
Which, I don’t. I believe in a real Savior.
“…you are, in fact, stupid.”
You haven’t given this whole atheism…I’m sorry, anti-theism…thing much thought have you? If someone believes in an imaginary Savior then that someone is stupid. Okay, maybe, I dunno. You don’t give us any reasons for accepting your premise. But regardless of whether or not your premise is true, Christians are not going to grant that Jesus is an imaginary Savior. And you have not shown that He is. So your “argument” is not persuasive, and it begs the question. Add these two strikes to your aforementioned approval of outdated evidentialism, and you’ve already struck out.
“Do you believe that a turkey sandwich in your fridge does yoga and smokes cigarettes when you close the door?”
Oh, ha ha! That’s funny! How absurd! So God-belief must be also. Only…it’s not. Or at any rate, the absurdity of God-belief does not follow from your silly picture. Because the two have nothing to do with one another. It also sounds like you may need to lay off smoking “cigarettes.”
“Certainly not, yet it is more believable than 90% of the Bible,”
Which I’m sure an enlightened anti-theist like yourself has read. On evilbible.com.
“…and you can actually prove a turkey sandwich exists.”
Maybe I could. I’m starting to have my doubts as to whether or not you could.
“Christians are stupid because there is a group-think mentality that forces rationality out of the equation.”
That’s funny, I’ve heard the same about anti-theists.
“I find it reprehensible that you mention that think you ‘know Christians better than the vast majority of atheists do,’ what makes you think so?”
Really? Reprehensible? Your type really need to get out more. I already mentioned why I think so. I’ve been in Christian circles for 30 years. I didn’t run off whining about them like you did.
“Atheists know Christians, they were raised by them, spent Sundays with them before realizing the folly, went to school, played, and worked with them.”
Oh, thank you for enlightening me!
“Atheists know Christians better than you could possibly imagine.”
“You are a closed minded hack who believes in something that is not only improbable, but logically impossible.”
Closed-minded means something like ‘intolerant of the beliefs of others.’ I’m sure that rather silly label should apply more to me in this setting than you. Yeah, that makes sense. Just to be clear, you would describe yourself as an *open-minded* “anti-theist” who runs around on the Internet calling Christians “stupid” and “hack[s]” and their beliefs “improbable,” “impossible,” and “imaginary”?
“Empirical data remarks are noted as well, I always love that, you do not even attempt to back up these ‘facts.’”
I don’t know what you’re talking about and your grammar does not help the situation.
“Here is a little data for you, religion is the cause, or a part of the cause, of nearly every war that has ever occurred on this planet (I sincerely hope you are not too stupid to acknowledge that).”
Because we were talking about “religion” and wars…?
Thanks for the reply, I wanted to say that yes, re wars, religion is a divisive issue. But also, this confirms to me something I’ve suspected for a long time, that more than ever this world needs to know Jesus of Nazareth more and more.
So, yes, religion is divisive. It’s probably the most divisive force aroun (at the very least it’s up there with political or economic ideologies). But Jesus of Nazareth was neither religious, nor irreligious, He was something different entirely. The message he taught was things like “the first will be last and the last will be first”, a kind of upside-down world where pride, self-righteousness, hypocrisy, selfishness, bigotry etc is all done away with and replaced with quiet, kind, peaceful, tolerant, humble, generous, patient, joyful, loving types of attitudes.
Your closed minded, bigoted, self-righteous, hypocritical and vitriolic attitude above is exactly the attitude that causes the wars you mention. Can you not see that? We all need a different attitude, especially religious people. That’s why we Christians keep going on about Jesus, because when you believe what He taught, you simply can’t adopt those sorts of attitudes (though, unfortunately, I know plenty of self-professed Christians who do). I know you must be frustrated with “whacky Christians” who believe in an invisible 3-in-1 sky daddy. I get frustrated with a lot of things like that too. But taking the stance you just took only makes things much much worse, I hope you can see that. I’m not trying to be a jerk, I’m just trying to point out that this is the real problem, and not belief in God.
And for the record, the number of religious related wars is less than 10%, so your claim is just plain false anyway. I suspect that it would not be hard show that instead of religion being the cause of wars, it’s actually the type of attitude you just demonstrated (closed-minded, bigoted, judgemental, self-righteous, etc) that causes wars.
The point being, we all need to hear the message of Jesus of Nazareth, I believe it is the only real solution.
The Atheist in my family is constantly posting things on facebook that are articles or videos that pretty much point out that Christians are idiots and homophobic bigots. And I admit many of these things being said are true about those specific situations. It’s like she is hunting for things to post of this nature. She has change her mission from sharing the Good News of Christ to now slamming Christian and the Christian faith. Then when her Christian friends take offense she denies that she’s saying this. Her actions speak louder then her words then. And what I don’t understand is why a college educated person who has many family members who are Christians and might read her posts put this stuff online. Doesn’t she know that she is going to offend them. And doesn’t she realize that where she lives is a large community of Christians. Or that when someone wants to hire someone they just might look on her facebook site and think maybe I don’t want someone working for me that’s so bitter and negative. I believe her post will do her more harm then good. At first I was very offended by what she posted but then I realized that all of us no matter who we are are all idiots, bigots and hateful at times. Those who do not see or admit to that and Repent are the truly fools. That’s one reason why I’m a Christian and think I have something no atheist will know. The forgiveness of my sins and the love of Jesus Christ on a daily moment by moment basis. I believe dwelling on what He did for me is the only healthy life to lead. Not always pointing out to others their sins and leaving them there.
“It’s like she is hunting for things to post of this nature.”
She probably is. It’s common to pick the worst examples of those you are opposed to in order to mock their view. She is also trying to justify her sin. See if the descriptions in this post sound familiar – https://choosinghats.org/2012/05/the-unbelievers-problem/
“At first I was very offended by what she posted but then I realized that all of us no matter who we are are all idiots, bigots and hateful at times.”
True, and it is okay to be offended as well, but remember in the end that unbelievers will act as unbelievers, and will do so precisely because they are dead in their sins. They cannot do other than sin unless and until Christ breaks through and sets them free from their sin.
“Not always pointing out to others their sins and leaving them there.”
You hit on a really important note, which is to make sure to present unbelievers not merely with their sin, but with the Christ who can save them from it.
Thanks for the comment!
Using the blanket term ‘atheists’ without using qualifiers such as ‘some’, ‘many’ or even ‘most’ is kind of insulting. I am atheist and happily acknowledge I have met many creationists that are not remotely stupid.
Sure I believe religious people are wrong about the existence of a supernatural being, in the same way you might think Scientologists are wrong about the existence of Xenu. But yet there are Scientologist lawyers, doctors and teachers etc. too, and that does not further their religious claims one iota.
The only thing that matters to me is evidence and so far creationist claims have never stood up to any scrutiny. Until that changes I will remain atheist. Certainly being called a fool by commentors such as Jim Chandler neither provides evidence for creationist claims nor endears me to the idea of superior Christian morality.
You’re a bit of a cry baby, but that is to be expected from Internet atheists as well.
What’s your evidence for holding that only evidence matters?
Thank you Garry for your kind words. 🙂 I believe the central issue for all atheists is evidence. What we can see tough or measure correct. But there are many things about us humans and this universe that we can not explain with evidence. I’m wondering if you’ve read Mere Christianity? God’s word says that each person has the law written on their hearts by the creator. To me this is the first thing that proves there is a God. If you’ve read that book what did you think?
Garry, I think that you have a fair point. Atheists are bundled together with statements such as “But atheists want to say much more than that there just happen to be stupid Christians.” I can see that would be unhelpful.
I do think you are mistaken though in suggesting that the reason one might reject Xenu is the same reason you reject the Christian God. I would wager that the reasons are actually entirely different (actually, I think there has been a recent blog post on this here).
Furthermore, did you know that there are Christians who are not creationists (and by that I take it you mean 7 day literal creationists, and young-earth proponents)? I ask because you seem to think that Christianity stands or falls on whether creationism is true or not. May I put it to you that it doesn’t stand or fall on that? You may be convinced that creationism is false, but so do many Christians. It’s important that when rejecting an idea, you actually reject it based on your conviction that it is false, and not on some conviction that some peripheral and non-essential issue on the fringe of that idea is false. That would be a silly mistake to make wouldn’t it?
I like your point about intelligent Christians. It seems to quickly forgotten that many academics who are Christian have proven themselves intellectually. This is done under strict supervision and have done so on par, or exceeded their course requirements, for a doctorate say. These people are just as qualified as an Atheist or agnostic academic would be. There seems to be a false assertion with some very biased people that if you are a Christian then you must be somewhat misguided. I have read on one web site Christians referred to as ‘Chrisio-idiots’. I think Christians seriously consider their lives, especially those who are academic because they may come under greater scrutiny if they teach in a secular setting for example. I would never think Atheists were foolish in anyway. They have been thoughtful about the world around them. I would argue their conclusions are wrong, but claim they were unintellectual would be an example of the pot calling the kettle black.
In this sense it’s pretty apparent that we’re dealing with the Internet phenomenon of “The Loudest Voices in the Room.” There are some atheists who like bashing Christians and some Christians that get off on bashing atheists. But you won’t hear the quiet, civil conversations going on in the corners b/c you either aren’t looking for them or they’re being wrecked by trolls.
I’m an atheist and I don’t think that all believers are idiots. Both sides have their idiots.
That said I have to take issue with your claim that “anti-theism presupposes theism.” Surely you wrote that just to get a rise, and you don’t really think that negation of an idea constitutes validation of that idea. It’s like saying “There are those who believe that Star Wars is a true story, but since I don’t believe that, the mere fact that I have acknowledged it as a concept means that I actually believe in it and it is true.” Pure poppycock.
Also, “what’s your evidence that only evidence matters?” Sir, you may not be stupid, but this phrase is nonsense. YOU use evidence to support everything. Yes, everything, even your belief in a supreme being. The only thing is, that evidence is flawed and unverifiable. And for some things, it’s fine to go on evidence of this sort. Trusting that your dog will still love you when you get back from vacation. That sort of thing you can probably just assume.
But when it comes to something as important as to, oh, I don’t know, the origin and meaning of everything in the universe, one should probably be a little more discerning about the evidence.
You are missing some context. When I say that “anti-theism presupposes theism” I allude to an apologetic argument that has been explained and defended on this website for over three years.
“It’s like saying ‘There are those who believe that Star Wars is a true story, but since I don’t believe that, the mere fact that I have acknowledged it as a concept means that I actually believe in it and it is true.’ Pure poppycock.”
I generally dislike analogies, and I especially detest bad ones. So let’s get back to what you are trying to say with respect to theism. Nowhere have I stated that acknowledging the concept of God means that a person actually believes in it and that it is true. A claim like that would be something more akin to the ontological argument. Perhaps that is a good argument. Perhaps not. But that is not the argument I am making, nor is it the argument I am alluding to.
“Also, ‘what’s your evidence that only evidence matters?’ Sir, you may not be stupid, but this phrase is nonsense.”
And yet, you made sense of it. Perhaps you meant to describe my statement with something other than “nonsense.”
“YOU use evidence to support everything.”
And I will most emphatically respond that no, I do not. Not in the sense you are thinking. Moreover, what is your evidence to support your claim?
“Yes, everything, even your belief in a supreme being.”
Repeating an assertion doesn’t make it less false. My belief in God is a properly basic, presuppositional sort of affair. Do I believe that there is evidence for the existence of God? Oh yes! Abundant and plain. But I’m not an evidentialist.
“The only thing is, that evidence is flawed and unverifiable.”
That’s your assertion. I’ve no reason or evidence for accepting it, and it is indicative of some faulty underlying presuppositions. If you’re looking for William Lane Craig or Norman Geisler you came to the wrong place.
I beg you to forgive my ignorance in the field of philosophy, as well as my not having enough time to read over your blog entries for the past three years. I’m sorry that you do not like my analogy. I am no Jesus with my parables, so I’ll try to stick with plain language from here on.
Personally, I detest presuppositional apologetics. I won’t use the word “nonsense” for fear of engaging in more semantic hairsplitting. Instead, let me say that the argument from pre-suppositional apologetics is maddeningly circular. Christian thinkers are forced into the uncomfortable situation of asserting that if their god exists, then such-and-such would be proof of his existence. They might as well condense this lemon of a philosophy into “God exists, therefor God exists.” (Tell me if you’ve heard this one).
You seem to enjoy exploiting the problem of infinite regress with other posters, including myself, in asserting that I should have evidence for my evidence. That’s really clever and funny, but can you tell me what Christianity would be without the Bible? What Islam would be without the Koran?
I “suppose” you would look around at the beauty and the intricacy of the world around you and would immediately know that the god, Yaweh, whose son, Jesus, died on the cross for the sins of the world had created all of it?
And the Bible, being your “evidence,” is subject to the exact problem of infinite regress that you tax your atheist posters with. So, yes, I still take issue with your statement. “Anti-theism” only pre-supposes theism in the sense that each concept could not exist without the other. You’ve given no evidence that your first cause, the existence of God, is true, so you cannot further assert that your second cause, there are no atheists in principle, is true.
BTW, like the Sesame Street reference. That takes me back.
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